ERNEST SAMUEL CLARKE, Farmer, Normanhurst, Tenindewa, sworn and examined:

6630. To the CHAIRMAN: I have been settled here for five years and was dairying in the Old Country on a small scale for five years before I came out. I took up 999 acres. About 780 are first class, eight acres are second class, and the rest third. The first class country here contains large mallee, spinifex, York gum, and jam. I am 19 miles north by north-west from the siding. I did not inspect the land before selecting it, but was perfectly satisfied with the description given in the Lands Office. I took it up in Perth. I have cleared 300 acres and have 100 acres partly cleared, but have no fencing done. I am a married man with a wife and two daughters living in England. My home is an iron-roofed camp, and I have bush stables, 60 by 24, and the same shed covers my implements also. I have not got a plough, but with that exception I have an efficient plant and five working horses. I had £140 capital, but had to send Home for another £50. I borrowed from the Agricultural Bank about £450 on clearing, horses, and machinery. After the drought year I had assistance from the Industries Assistance Board, and owe them about £580, including rents and everything paid by them. It also includes the current year's advance. My last account received in March showed £510 in debt, and I have had £70 since then. The rainfall where I am is about 12 inches, but erratic. About three-fifths of the rain falls in the winter months.

6631. To Mr CLARKSON: I have 200 acres cropped and 20 acres of self-sown crop for stripping purposes, but no fallow. However, about 70 acres were ploughed with a neighbour's plough, but that looks no better than the rest of the crop. Part of that which is ploughed has never yielded more than seed before, but this year it looks like about three bags to the acre. Some old land which was cultivated and cropped each year is yielding more heavily than any other and it was only scratched with a cultivator. Last year I took 770 bags off and estimate that I lost 200 bags through the storms that we had. That 770 bags was over 230 acres harvested. This year I think it will go four bags. I sowed to the acre 45lbs. of Yandilla King, and 50lbs. of super. I grow the light wheats. I have not tried early wheats until this year and that was a failure—Bunyip. It was against all advice, but I could not help myself. My own opinion is that Firbank's would be better.

6632. From your observations in the district, Gluyas seems to show the best results. How many bags must you get to pay your actual expenses before getting any profit for yourself, including depreciation?—I do not know from experience. I went into figures once, however, and the results were so appalling that I turned it up.

6633. You cannot possibly farm at the distance that you are, but if you had a siding within a couple of miles what do you think your costs would be of putting in and taking off?—I think I would have to get three bags off, taking wear and tear and all in, and there is no doubt that bulk handling would help in the reduction of costs. I do not think that tariff affects us very much, but coming as I do from a free trade country the distance from here to our markets is sufficient protection. We are in competition with America, which is a high wage country, and has any amount of shipping. We are not so fortunate as regards shipping here, and there is always a tendency for freight to be increased. The American liners, however, can take wheat as ballast. Of course I am a free trader, but if you work out the cost of machinery with the tariff added you would find that the price of wheat itself would ultimately be but little affected. I used to be opposed to protection in England, but since the war started we have found out to our cost that though we made money through free trade as a nation, yet now, during the currency of the was, we have lost money by virtue of free trade. Germany, on the other hand, has been protectionist all the time and had subsidised all her industries. Hal it not been for our navy we should have been done long before now, because we would not have been able to provide food for he Homeland. We have been sending away machinery and coal, and in return other countries have sent us wheat, which we have been able to get, thanks to the navy. There are 50 million acres of cultivable land in Great Britain, and we produce only £4 per acre's worth. Germany, on the other hand, produces £8 per acre cent. per cent. more than we do. Belgium, which was a great protectionist country, produced £20 worth per acre on her cultivable land, so if free trade has anything to do with the matter, the evidence is obviously favourable to protectionist countries. Then again, Germany has a leasehold system of tenure, and German colonists attribute much of their success to the perpetual leasehold system prevailing in South Australia.

6634. To Mr PAYNTER: Last year my crops had rust and septoria. I do not pickle or grade my wheat, and I have made no experiments with fodder plants, fruit trees, or vegetables. I have not gone in for pigs either. We had the Government dairying expert, Mr Connor, here lecturing on pigs, but my own opinion is that if dairying is attempted in this district it will be a failure. As you know, the pork and dairy market is the most sensitive of all markets. You may get one or two good seasons, but once you have started supplying bacon you cannot do anything else with your pork. Suppose we were to establish a bacon factory at Geraldton, for instance, the stock must be of a certain weight, and if the pigs get too fat there would be no market for the residue. Geraldton could not live on pork. Then the railway service is too slow and the climate too hot for pigs to travel to the City. If we could sell weaners from six to eight weeks old it would be better than any factory, but in a word we are too far from railway facilities to do anything with an export trade in pigs, and the local consumption is infinitesimal. Whenever I employ a man I pay him 35s. a week and his tucker, and would expect him to work 8 hours a day. I think a square mile of good country should be ample for any man to handle in this district, and with some assistance at harvest and seed time, and sewing bags the farmers should be able to cultivate 500 acres, 250 acres fallow, and 250 in crop. I do not think it would pay to crop more than 250 acres, in fact that is all he could do. I have no opinion to express on the question of co-operation, although I see no valid objection to it. the price of the land is most bewildering. For instance, at Tenindewa, near the siding, it is 4s. Further out it is 10s. Mr Duncan Ballantyne, one of our most successful local farmers, asked me to point this anomaly out to you on behalf of those living in his vicinity. My own opinion is that if I were near the siding 10s. an acre would be far too much. In the Old Country I used to pay £4 per acre per annum for my land, but here a man should get his land for free for the first five years.

6635. By Mr CLARKSON: You spoke about land near the station being 4s., while your own