success that they should be. The minimum quantity of land that a farmer should hold here is 1,000 acres. My own family pioneered this district with tenant farmers, and found that the men with larger holdings made good, while the small men, with only 100 or 200 acres, did not seem to get ahead of it. A man should crop and fallow. The whole matter is a question of the ability of a man and his means. I consider the price of Government land is too high. The price should depend on the quality and situation of the land. In this district the land has been purchased many years ago at 10s. and that is a fair price to pay for it. I would go further than that; I would give a man the land entirely and let the title issue after he had produced so many thousand bushels of wheat within a stipulated time. The improvements would have to be done to enable him to produce the quantity. We shall have to adopt some such system as that if we are going to successfully compete with Canada.

7310. By Mr. VENN: Do you agree with Mr. Connor that this is a dairying district?—My experience has been that when the family moves out to work for themselves, the father gives up dairying. People who used to make butter here are giving it up now. One could make large quantities of ensilage in the winter here, and freezing works in Geraldton, together with a butter factory, would be a very great encouragement. Some years ago I induced the Government to get Mr. McCann to come here and report on the suitability of freezing works here, and he afterwards went to Kimberley. In the old days in this country, they used to shepherd their pigs, and the firm of Black Bros., some years ago, used to purchase large quantities of pigs for the Kalgoorlie market.

7311. By the CHAIRMAN: What are your railway facilities?—We have both the Midland line and the Government line. All things considered, they are satisfactory, but the Midland people always do what they can to meet us. Last winter we asked for a concession for Wednesday's sales at Midland. They met us as well as they could, and they are holding back Tuesday's train to suit us. Their freights are the same as those of the Government. The expense of sending sheep to Midland per bogey is about £11 10s., that is 1s. 6d. per head, and on lambs about 1s. 4½d. The long run in the train takes 2lbs. weight off them. They leave here on Tuesday morning and arrive the next day. They are in the yard all night, in the truck all Monday and Tuesday, and are sold at 11a.m.; that is too long a wait, although it is fair transit. If there is a bogey to spare they let us know, and we always load it up, and we get them down on the mail train.

7312. By Mr. PAYNTER: What is the depth of soil in this district?—The Greenough has probably been the bottom of an immense fresh water lake and has been created by glacial action, and it is all level. There is no clay subsoil. In the growing season we must have rain for a fortnight otherwise we get anxious.

7313. By the CHAIRMAN: Have you any working acquaintance with the Bowes, Oakabella, and other repurchased estates?—I cannot express an opinion about them. There have not been any repurchased estates in the Greenough. Our banking facilities are quite satisfactory. There are not so many tenant farmers here now. In the old days our terms were that they could go on to a piece of a land rent free, and if there were any improvements we would find the wire or iron and they would put them up. We found the timber and iron for a house and they carted the stone. They would have their own plant. After five years they paid one-fourth of the proceeds to us. If they had no crop we got no rent. I cannot say what it would be now, as I have been out of it for years. There is a poison called "onion" poison or grass poison on the tops of the hills from here to Dongarra, and there is some York road poison at the back. I regard my Conditional Purchase country as a place to give my stock a change for a month and then they are put back in the paddocks. If one started to over-stock the country one would burst it up. The settlers around here are tending more towards cross-breds than they were formerly. The rainfall is about 18 inches, as far as I can guess. The last serious drought I can just about remember; it was in 1881. I was at Jurien Bay at the time. Then we had a bad time in the nineties, and also two years ago. This year the crops have been put back by the dry September. I have never had to ship my sheep, although I did so the season before last. There is no vacant land as far as I know in this locality.

7314. Who holds the country to the eastward?—I hold 2,000 acres, and besides myself there are Logue, Willmott, the Ellendale estate, and Mr. Broad and then you get down to the Midland concession. Greenough is five miles from Walkaway.

(The witness retired.)

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The Commission adjourned.