7549. By Mr Paynter: People might supply themselves with water cheaper in the long run if someone investigated the case? -I agree with that.

7550. By Mr Clarkson: Do you think there is anything practicable in the suggestion? In the first place what is the ordinary lift of the pipe lines? -I am sorry to say we are having trouble with the mains which have been only down for a few years. They have given us serious trouble, but they are worked out for twenty years of life.

7551. Would there be anything practicable in the suggestion that during the lift of these extensions the settlers served by them should be assisted to provide a sufficiently large capacity on their own holdings so as to give them a water supply in case the extension might collapse? -I certainly think they should be assisted in that direction.

7552. But do you think it would be a practicable matter? -Some settlers are blessed with catchments and suitable places for conserving water, but some are not. Others again may have a chance if they were in a granite outcrop of getting a good well. I have worked this out in different schemes before I went into the North Merredin question. These pipes are 120 miles long. I had to consider all these questions about subterranean water conservations by means of artificial and natural catchments, but it worked out in favour of Mundaring pipes in cost.

7553. By the Chairman: You are referring to the North Merredin extension and you went into the question of settlers supplying themselves with water and concluded that the Mundaring water would be the cheaper for them? -My idea was that the Government or the settler did the work, and my system seemed to me to be a fair thing, yet it was considerably in favour of the Mundaring scheme.

7554. By Mr Clarkson: What would you estimate the cost of, say, a 3,000 yard tank under your system of Government construction? -First of all I would require to know what was the class of country and whether it was solid clay that would hold water. Mr experience is that an ordinary excavated tank would not carry one through a dry season. The time when water is most wanted is at the tail end of the long summer. My tanks were lined and roofed on the Goldfields and are like a water bottle with a cork in it.

7555. How are they lined? -Sometimes with the O'Brien patent asphalt and sometimes with asphalt. It is a mixture. There are only two places on the Eastern Goldfields where there is clay and that is not very good. I can tell you straight out there is no clay in Western Australia in any tank that will show less than 30 per cent absorption. I have tried it in what is considered to be pretty good clay; that is to say, combined with a certain amount of ironstone and grit. The absorption of 30 per cent is plus the evaporation, which will amount to 7ft. per annum. You will have an empty tank in six months.

7556. Taking Merredin or Kellerberrin, if you get 12ft. in the clay will it give you a permanent supply in a 2,000 yard dam? -You will have to allow 7ft. for evaporation and a certain amount for absorption and the balance is the consumption. You must work it out to carry you over to the next rain. 12 ft. in my opinion is too shallow; it should never be made less than 15ft. in depth and on the Goldfields they are mostly 18ft. If a man does not get a good run-off rain, a quick shower, well and good; he may get drizzling rains, but they are not any good for conservation.

7557. In many places if you go more than 12ft. you take the risk of getting salt water? -Yes, you may go through the clay.

7558. By the Chairman: Have you done tank sinking in any other part of Australia? -All my work in the Eastern States was in connection with railway and bridge construction, but here we can lose them all in tank construction. All the States write to us and ask for our advice. They have not carried it out to such a fine point as we have on the Goldfields. With regard to conservation in the dry areas, South Africa was glad to get notes from us here and so was Queensland. They have not had the opportunity that we have had of our experience over twenty year upon the Goldfields. With us it is an absolute necessity to catch the water.

7559. By Mr Clarkson: Can you give us any idea, taking the average, approximately of the price per yard it would cost to put down 4,000 yards, which would be a big tank? -The price per yard with the present price of labour would be from 2s 6d. to 3s. but fifteen years ago it was only 1s 6d. on the Goldfields.

7560. What is the total cost of lining and roofing? You say it costs 2s 6d. for excavation? -The lining is at per square yard. I cannot remember how many there are in a 2,000 yard tank, but a half million gallon tank, that is 3,000 yards, is a typical tank on the Goldfields, where it is lined and roofed and the catchment fences and a pump and toughing for cattle about 60 ft. long, and other small details—the whole would run into £2,500 and that might be situated 100 miles from the railway.

7561. But the farmer only wants sufficient to carry him over for two year? -Yes. Here is a copy of a report on the North Merredin extensions, which touches upon that (extracts from report read).

7562. The Chairman: Conclusions are in favour of Mundaring water, according to Mr O'Brien's report.

7563. Mr Clarkson: Taking my particular circumstances. I have a place of 6,000 acres, and I am running the whole of my farming operations with a 2,000 yard tank, 12 ft. deep, excavated in clay. It is in a good rainfall area and I use it the whole year through. It will be filled in October and would have to last from them until the first week in June. I have usually fifty or sixty draught horses there. I have no catchment, but, of course, the men on the farm have their own domestic tanks from the roof of their houses. The dam is purely for stock and there is no question, therefore, of pollution. At Kellerberrin it is a different proposition. The rainfall is a little erratic. I have seen it less than 12 inches. There is a lot more rain in your country. The number of wet days is about the same as where you are referring to, but the fall is lighter. You have not only a slower rain in the same period, which is too late for conservation, but a higher evaporation, more dry heat, and then you have a farmer with 1,000 acres. He could not afford to leave 200 acres of that like you go for stock. He must plough all his land and you would not get any run off with a light rain.