think the only policy is for the Government to find ewes for settlers. The only people who have made good here are those who have sheep. If next season is as good as this, I shall knock off my overdraft altogether. Dairying can be made to pay well for a time, but there might be difficulty in the summer months. Cows milk well till the end of November, from June. I have not tried what could be done then with feeding. We have about 10lbs. of butter at home from a couple of cows.

8272. By the CHAIRMAN: You do not infer that cultivation should be dropped altogether? - No, but sheep and cultivation work together and cannot be divorced. With stock the future is bright, without stock it is the reverse. Almost any block of 1,000 acres out here would run 200 ewes and that means £200 a year, and sheep require no attention. The poison is cleared along the road, still it is better to truck them in. I kill for a lot of settlers, and quite a few have sent in fat lambs to market.

(The witness retired.)

CHARLES DUNN, Manna Farm, East Narrogin, sworn and examined:

8273. By the CHAIRMAN: How long have you been settled in the district?- I came here in 1908. From 1895 to 1903 I spent on farms and stations in Victoria and New South Wales, and I was mining from 1903 to 1908. I hold 1,030 acres of land. For wheat growing I do not consider any of it first class. It is really second class, salmon gum, morrell, and a little jam. It is second class because it is too low lying, it would be first if it was undulating. The price is 10s. It is distant three miles from a railway. With the exception of 92 chains, it is boundary fenced, divided into five paddocks with three wires; 430 acres are cleared. There is one dam of 1,000 yards, 9ft. 6in. deep, which has silted up to 8ft. but it has never yet been dry.

I am a married man with four children and three attend school eight miles distant. We have been negotiating to get a school at Toolibin. I have a two-roomed hessian and lean-to house, 30ft. x 12., bush stables, machinery shed, a set of implements, nine working horses, two cows, a pig and fowls. I started with £300 capital and borrowed £724 from the Agricultural Bank. I owe the Industries Assistance Board and creditors about £700. I have 310 acres of crop, 10 acres of hay -- 600 bags of wheat and 14 tons of hay, the equivalent of six bushels to the acre.

8274. By Mr. PAYNTER: How do you account for the low average?- That is due to the land being too wet; 140 acres was fallowed. I do not think fallow is always the correct thing. I got 20 bags of 15 acres of fallow. I plough 4in. deep and cultivate with a disc twice. Federation gives the best returns. I sow 45lbs. of that and 60lbs. of Yandilla King, or Alpha, to the acre. Nine bushels was my highest average, in 1909. In the drought year I got 2½ bushels. I reckon it cost 35s. to put in and take off a crop, reckoning my own time at labourers' wages and that figure includes everything as well as the interest and depreciation. I use a four-furrow stump jump mouldboard and an eight furrow disc plough. I use six horse with the mouldboard and do four acres a day. With the eight-furrow and six horses I do eight acres a day, with a 13-disc drill 12 acres. I use four leaf harrows and do 20 acres a day, and with the binder eight acres.

I have a stripper and winnower. With the stripper I did 310 acres in 30 working days with two teams. I do not think the large implements and teams would reduce cost, at least not in my case. The tariff is quite disasterous and should be abolished, or reduced, or a subsidy paid to make wheat growing payable. Personally, I think it would be impossible to make wheat growing a success, taking the district average as nine bushels, because, under present conditions, it takes nine bushels to pay bare expenses, and not allowing anything for one's own wages. There is a deficit, in fact of 5s. an acre on the cost of putting in. That should be made up. The farmer should be provided with labourer's wages by way of a subsidy. Bulk handling would no doubt be a good thing and would effect a saving. I have had no disease in my crops except grubs. I grade my wheat. Fruit trees are not a success out here. I have paid £56 in wages only in eight years.

To make a living in this district a man should hold 1,500 acres and he should have at least 300 acres cleared, but not fallow, annually. I could only get 60 acres fallow done owing to the weather conditions. My country was swampy. The land will not yield what is claimed for it. The price, however, seems to be reasonable. The farmer should have five years rent free as the land is of no value, even under the best conditions, until it is improved. Open forest country costs 23s. an acres to clear.

8275. By the CHAIRMAN: Why do you continue to grow crops? - For the reason that I have expended every shilling I possess on the land and eight years of labour at 12 hours a day, and my only alternative is to roll up my swag and go away and look for work. If however, I had undulating country, the position would be different.

8276. By Mr. VENN: You believe in mixed farming? - Yes, and I believe I could pull through with that. At present I carry 200 sheep and with some further improvements, and additional water, even more than that. I am working under the Industries Assistance Board and they will assist with cropping but not with sheep. If I get a nine bushel average for eight years I could pull through but not on six bushels, and that has been the average here for eight years. I have been trying to farm the land under decent conditions. This season I intend to put it in early without rain. Last season I stripped nine bushels from self-sown.

8277. By the CHAIRMAN: You are the first witness we have had whose land is on flat country.

(The witness retired.)

VIVIAN ROBERT JEFFREY (Jeffery Bros.), Farmer, East Wagin, sworn and examined: 

8278. By the CHAIRMAN: How long have you been settled in the district? - Since 1908. I had no previous experience of farming, and followed the occupation of a clerk. I hold 3,840 acres; 2,500 are first class and the balance good grazing country. The price varies from 5s. to 13s., and the average would be about 7s. 3d. an acre. The property is 2½ miles from the railway. 1,400 acres are fenced with three wires and subdivided into six paddocks, 1,100 acres are cleared. I have one dam 17 feet deep,