amount we have advanced for machinery and horses, the plant represents a large amount. The amount we paid for cornsacks last year £70,152. Super. is another big item, and this year we estimate it will cost £100,000.

8721. Have you any idea of what your expenses of management are ? - I have not got them in regard to the board ; it would take a considerable time.

8722. Are the books of the board being kept in a style that the particulars are readily obtainable ? - Yes, We always give those figures with regard to the bank. There is no difficulty in giving the figures of the cost of distribution.

8723. By Mr. VENN : In many cases in which we have met the settlers complain that they have no statements ? - That is not correct ; statements have been sent out in every case. The statements are forwarded with the invoices in every case, but we do not want to send statements out every month in detail ; it is a big job.

8724. By the CHAIRMAN : The policy the bank adopts is to get the statements out on the 31st March ? - Yes, but some want statements every month. There should be no difficulty in knowing approximately what they are owing. They have a document in which they can enter up the payments and they know what machinery, etc., is supplied.

8725. By Mr. PAYNTER : Does the bank allow the settler to make up his returns from stock which he should make in regard to stock. If he has not the crop to make up his indebtedness, can he make it up in stock ? - We have no lien over his stock at all ; there is no doubt a certain amount of wheat that should come to the board which is used to feed his pigs and his stock is marketed and he gets the benefit.

8726. There is a large amount of self - sown crop and it is a question whether a settler should be allowed to grass his sheep on it and make a return to the board as to the grazing ? - We have no hold over his sheep at all at the present time. There was an amendment proposed in the last Bill to give us security over all his assets and I think we should have had that. We should have handled all the settlers assets and he was clear, but the amendment was thrown out.

8727. I do not think you quite understand my question. Say a man is supposed to put in 200 acres of cropping and he only puts in 100 acres, the board says you must have the other in, but the man replies, I have so many sheep and I will return an equivalent in sheep ? - We have never made such an arrangement. If we assisted a man to put in 200 acres and he only puts in 100 acres, we reduce his advance.

8728. But very often he has the super. on the land ? - He would have to account for the super. If he has not put in the area agreed to, he has to account for the super. and the advance is reduced accordingly.

8729. By the CHAIRMAN : Since the reorganised control the manager of the Agricultural Bank and yourself have the control ? - Yes.

8730. You do not have a board ? - Yes, the two trustees of the bank, Mr. Richardson and Mr. Cook and Mr Maitland Leake, they meet once a week.

8731. By Mr. PAYNTER : You simply administer their decisions ? - Either Mr. Paterson or myself deal with every application that comes in in the same way as with the bank and make recommendations to the board ; they approve or otherwise. The board do not deal with details ; they delegate their powers to a great extent to Mr. Paterson and myself to approve of the small expenditure.

8732. You in your good judgment refer to them matters which you consider more in their province to deal with than in yours ? - Yes. Applications for machinery are put before the board with recommendations whether they should be approved of or not.

8733. You are also connected with the Agricultural Bank ? - Yes My official position has always been Deputy Manager and Trustee. I have the same power and same authority to act as Mr. Patterson. It was only on the amalgamation of the two departments that the title was altered, in fact, officially, the title has not been altered yet.

8734. Does the bank advance to settlers to pay off existing liabilities ? - We have power under the Act, but we do it only in limited cases. We advanced £22,346 last year to pay off liabilities and since the bank has been in operation we have advanced £256,792. In normal times we do it fairly extensively but we have had to restrict our operations somewhat in all but absolutely necessary circumstances.

8735. Under the restricted conditions what is the bank's general policy ? - We only advance to pay off liabilities in any special cases. As a general rule we do not make advances to pay off mortgages, but we would do if a man was likely to lose his property by being squeezed, but as a general rule we are not doing it now. All of this is owing to the financial position.

8736. Apart from that, what is the bank's general policy now ? - We lay down a definite policy as to clearing. It is necessary for every settler to have at least 600 acres cleared.

8737. That is what you do now ? - It has been recognised for some time. It is only since the present Minister took office that the matter has been pushed. We have now notified the settlers through our inspectors that efforts have to be made in every case to bring the clearing up to 600 acres for which the bank will pay ; in those cases the settlers paying only half value. We advance full up to £50 and after that 50 per cent., but now we have notified the settlers through the inspectors that there must be 600 acres cleared. I do not think we shall be able to straightaway bring every man up to the 600 acres because the funds are not available, but we shall do it gradually. That will be laid down as a definite policy and every effort will be made to assist the settler to do it. He will have to get the clearing done. The man who has got 300 acres cleared and keeps cropping will not be able to pull through. Some of the settlers are cropping the same land year after year. We have laid down a definite policy as to sheep, the trustees realising that settlers must have sheep to carry on in conjunction with wheat farming, and as soon as funds are available that matter will be taken up seriously, and everyone in a position to carry sheep will be supplied.

8738. Do you not recognise the great danger there is in outback districts ? - It would be no use supply -