indirect subsidies to create railway freight. Three or four years ago Mr. Connor practically damned the proposal for dairying in this district. In connection with fruit, our apples are lying under the trees going to waste. Central markets and cold storage should be established in Perth. Jam-making will not overcome the difficulty on account of the low value of the quantity of fruit used in the finished product. By the establishment of evaporators in Perth much of the value of this fruit could be saved. We have in the town one man who bought an evaporator which cost him £71 landed. He is getting 280lbs. of dried fruit from one ton of fresh. If that sells at 8d. per lb. it will realise approximately £9 6s. 8d. per ton. At the rate we have been selling in the markets in many cases we have been lucky to get 2s., or about £3 6s. per ton. If the evaporators were established, the enterprise could be handled co-operatively. Because we cannot export our fruit we cannot get any price at all. We are feeding stock on fruit of the highest class. (The witness retired.)

HUGH AUGUSTUS MOORE, representing the Kenkenny branch of the F. & S., Farmer, East Wagin, sworn and examined:

9747. To Mr. CLARKSON: I am farming 3,270 acres, of which all but 400 is first class. I have 1,000 cleared and 50 in crop. My normal crop is 250 acres, of which 100 would be fallow. In my opinion the fallow is no better than the other portion of the crop. I run 800 sheep, that is about the full carrying capacity of my place at its present stage. I have 25 horses and nine cattle. The highest average I have had was 10 bushels of wheat and 12 of oats. My normal average is eight bushels. To pay costs I require 12 bushels at 10s. a bag. I have seen bulk handling in Wisconsin, America. I am sure it would reduce the cost here. My holding is 12 miles from a railway. If bulk handling were instituted the handling of the stuff between the field and the railway could best be done by a travelling threshing machine working on co-operative methods. I think farmers' implements should come in free from duty. Free trade would be greatly to the benefit of the farmer. The railway freights on manure have been excessive.

9748. To Mr. PAYNTER: I favour the continuance of the wheat pool. My district has not received any advantage direct or indirect from the experts or officials of the Agricultural Department. I think the present land laws are not calculated to induce people to take up the land. The land is too dry and the payments should be extended over 40 years. I paid 10s. for my land for 20 years. My branch considers the land values too high.

9749. To Mr. VENN: I do no dairying except for my own use. I think the district is suitable for dairying. Cows milk six months on the natural grasses. I am to the east of the line. The western side of the line is better adapted for oats and sheep than for wheat.

9750. By Mr. CLARKSON: Have you any suggestions to make for the betterment of the agricultural industry and land settlement generally?—The larger farmers are paying too much interest for money borrowed and invested, and my branch suggests that the Commonwealth bank should assist farmers the same as private banks at lower interest and that co-operation on behalf of the farmers should be assisted by the Government. The farmers have too many taxes to pay, Federal, State, and local authority. (The witness retired.)

ERNST GUSTAV HERMANN GANZER, Farmer, Wagin, sworn and examined:

9751. To Mr. CLARKSON: I have been farming 14 years in this district. I hold 1,400 acres, of which 600 is first class and 900 cleared. I have in crop 170 acres. Generally I crop 300 to 400 acres, of which on an average 200 would be fallow. I consider it does not pay to fallow. Fallow as a rule is too conservative of moisture for the seasons we have been getting. The highest average I had had is 12 bushels, the normal average being nine of wheat and 12 of oats. Cropping costs 30s. I use a 4-furrow plough and a 6-foot harvester. Generally speaking a man can reduce his costs by using the largest machinery to which the land will lend itself. Walker wheat does well in this district. The proper selection of wheat is not, in my opinion, of the highest importance. Bulk handling would reduce our costs. Farming machinery should come in free of duty. I run 500 sheep. That is the full carrying capacity of my place in its present stage of development. I have 20 horses and nine cattle.

9752. To Mr. PAYNTER: I have a reduced area under crop this year because I have not been on the place myself and besides the season has been unfavourable to sowing. I favour the continuation of the wheat pool. We have not had any benefit from the experts or officials of the Agricultural Department. Our present land laws are not calculated to encourage people to take up land. Too much is asked for poor country.

9753. To Mr. VENN: I have tried dairying on a small scale. It did not pay me. I think dairying could be carried on successfully in this district if we had a butter factory. I am east of the line. I usually go in for both oats and wheat. The former gives the better return. We are not troubled with dingoes.

9754. To Mr. CLARKSON: A perpetual lease would be better than being asked too high a price for the conditional purchase of poor country. I would value grazing country at about 3s.

9755. By Mr. CLARKSON: Have you any suggestion as to what the State might do for the betterment of the industry?—The ring fence condition insisted upon by the Agricultural Bank is only throwing money away. Assistance should be given for the erection of the settler's house. I would allow £400 as a maximum for this. (The witness retired.)

PHILLIP JAMES TOLL, Farmer, N.E. Wagin, sworn and examined:

9756. To Mr. CLARKSON: I have been farming here for 14 years. Previously I was for 20 years in Northern Victoria. I hold 4,400 acres, of which 500 is first class. I have cleared about 700 acres, but I bought other cleared land making it up to 1,100 acres.