a pipe system or channels lined with cement throughout. I accepted the engineer's statement that the land would hold because I thought he knew something about it. We find now from experience that instead of the channels holding water, as he stated they would do, and that only a few places would require to be lined, that there are only one or two places which do not require lining, and the question of seepage has become a serious one. Plans and specifications were submitted to the settlers here, and certain portions of the channels were marked, especially where they ran through planted orchards. It was shown that through these planted orchards the water would be conveyed through pipes; and the whole of the river channels were marked in a similar way. For some reason or other, and we have had every excuse given to us, the pipes were not used, and where the channels were taken through planted orchards they were simply open channels. They deviated from the plans, and in some cases they took the channels along the fences. The question of deviation and the question of excision of the concrete pipes was never submitted to the settlers, although we objected whenever opportunity offered. The scheme came to be practically concluded, and it was handed over and a rate was struck. I would like to give you my own experience, and the result of the seepage on my own trees. One of my blocks of 10 acres contains trees which are 13 years old. My blocks are Nos. 70, 72, and 74. At the intersection of 72 and 74 a tremendous amount of seepage takes place, and it has practically killed the trees. As I pointed out to Mr. George when he was here recently, the trees are so sick that before I can gather any fruit at all, they will have to be cut back, and two years must elapse before I can take a single orange from them. Block 74 is entirely tile drained. Block 72 is about two-thirds drained. Where the trees to which I have referred are standing, some of them are within a few feet of the tile drain. It was quite common last year when the water was running down that channel, for the seepage to extend in the course of a night from the south-east corner of block 72 fully 10 chains in a northerly direction. I did not worry last year about that because it was tile drained, and I thought that any excess water would be carried away by the pipes, but practical experience has told me that that is not so, and that citrus trees will not stand too much moisture even when there are tile drains. In block 74 there is a slight depression. Despite the fact that it is tile drained, the water has been running now for 24 hours, and this morning there is a surface pool there which has come from the channel. That proves that although it runs to within a few feet of the fence, the excess water coming in from that channel is greater than is the capacity of the tiles to carry off. I can quote you other cases, but what I have told you is typical of practically the whole settlement.

10389. Did the Act provide that the plans had to be approved by the settlers?—Yes; and although we wanted either the pipe system or channel, the pipes are not there at all. A sum of £2,800 was ear-marked for cement lining, but I do not think 1s. has been spent in that direction. We have been battling and objecting, and we have even objected to pay our rate.

10390. If the Act lays it down that certain plans have to be approved, and if that is departed from the contract has not been carried out?—That is our point, but we cannot get satisfaction. Several Ministers have been down here, including Mr. Mitchell and Mr. George. Mr. Oldham's excuse was that, owing to the war, the cost of material was excessive. That is no satisfaction to us.

10391. Is the irrigation otherwise satisfactory?—I would not like to say that it is. The contract of the Government was to delivery the water to the highest point on a block which was often in the middle of the block. The Government, however, are content to deliver water to the highest point on the boundary. I would not like to say whether the word boundary is used in the agreement or not.

10392. By Mr. VENN: Do you think the pipe system would have been the best?—Unquestionably.

10393. And do you think that spraying would be the best?—Yes; you can spray between the trees, but that becomes very expensive. The unlined channel system brings down all the noxious. There are men here who have spent thousands in trying to keep the couch under. There is couch now in some of my blocks which never knew that grass before. It is a great curse.

10394. By Mr. PAYNTER: Do you still say then that the pipe system would be better?—Unquestionably, or even cement lined channels, and the weeds would not then grow at the sides. That is the only salvation of the scheme here; it must be cemented or piped. If something like this is not done, half of the settlers here will be ruined. A man planted some potatoes between his trees. His neighbour a fortnight later irrigated his block. There was an avenue between the two. The irrigation was done on Friday and Saturday, and on the Monday the seepage had got under the avenue and rotted all the seed potatoes. You could smell them as you passed down the avenue. That is one result of the seepage.

10395. By the CHAIRMAN: What is your estimate of the cost of getting an acre of orchard in this district into full productive working order?—If you are a resident it is cheaper than if you are an absentee. I was an absentee for seven years. As an absentee it ran me into £80 an acre. Had I been living on my block it would not have cost that much. That does not include tile draining. The cost of tile draining is £150 per block.

10396. What do you estimate your operating cost; including the cost of fertilising, the cost of putting it on the land, the cost of cultivating, spraying, and all the operations you conducted from year to year in order to produce your fruit?—I do not think the expenses would be under £120 or £130 per block of 10 acres. I would make it £140 or £150 to do it properly.

10397. What do you estimate the water costs you, to put on, and to pay the rate?—My blocks are fairly well graded, and yet I cannot irrigate a 10-acre block, with two men, under three days. There you have £3 in wages only. Then there is the cultivation afterwards. You must cultivate twice with a spring tooth or disc, and that is a three day's job. It would cost £5 or £6 to irrigate the block. That would be 10s. per acre, in addition to the cost of the water, and if we irrigate twice a year, as the Government told us, we would have to double that. I am well within the mark if I state that if the Government permit the scheme to stand as it is, and do not give us a pipe system, or cemented channels, the whole thing