GEORGE DUNKLEY, Farmer, Capel, sworn and examined:

10607. To Mr. CLARKSON: I have been 12 years in this district. I hold about 450 acres on the Stirling Estate and I have some bush paddocks, about 1,500 acres altogether. I engage in dairying. This district is most suitable for dairying and the industry is on the increase. We milk 35 cows just now. I can carry about 130 cattle all the year round on all my property. When I came here first I used to feed on maize and stuff, but since I have had water couch, I do not hand feed at all. I milk all the year round on the natural grasses. The cash return from the 35 cows is £50 to £60 a month. The last three months it has been over £60. I sent my cream half to Perth for table purposes and the other half to Macfarlane's for butter. I have been going back from the short horn to the Jersey. I have a big family and they are all a considerable help.

10608. Will dairying generally be profitable to those who have to employ labour?—In my own instance, it would be troublesome, but in other ways it will be overcome. Alter your land laws and bring over dairy men from Victoria is what I would suggest. I would say to Victorian or other dairy-men "Here is some land, you can have it for 20 years and you can start paying for it at the end of that period." Then in a few years this State could produce its own butter. At the present time we are losing £1,000 a day. That is a serious item. I am positive that the plan I suggest would be effective. There are hundreds of good dairymen working on the share system in Victoria who would be glad to come over on these terms. It is an uphill game paying rent at the beginning.

10609. Have you had any experience of milking machines?—I do not believe in them.

10610. What area do you think a man should be established on?—320 acres if he is to be successful, and he can always fossick around and buy more. So far as land settlement goes, the Agricultural Bank is very good, but it is particularly a failure because it is a question of borrowing from one institution to pay another one. The thing is a farce. The Government is on a good wicket. The Government has land which is lying idle. Why should it start to pay revenue immediately a man puts his foot on it. The forest here is a terrible thing to handle. It simply breaks a man up, but there are many good men who can battle through and make a living. When it comes to finding the rents, that is another matter. The Government should be satisfied if they could get people to go on the land. These people should have it rent free for a term. I came from Victoria and brought stock with me. When you get off the Stirling Estate and a few of the picked spots, the land is not as good as that in Victoria. The Victorian dairyman, moreover, gets a bonus. The Government here cannot give us a bonus on account of the Federal Constitution, but it should meet us in another way, the way I have suggested. We should have our cows tested by the Government free of charge. With regard to bulls, two months ago I wasted three or four weeks travelling about the country trying to pick up a decent animal, and I had to come back to my own door and pay 40 guineas for one. That should not be. New South Wales has 40 bulls, which are let out in the different districts to farmers at reasonable charges. These bulls have been brought from the Old Country and are good stock. That is a move in the right direction. In Queensland they have between 30 and 40, which they let out to farmers. The absence of bulls is one of our great drawbacks. In New South Wales they have been bringing some of the best blood from the Old Country. The country that can afford to throw out £1,000 daily for dairy produce should be able to afford to do something for the industry in the direction I have suggested. Three years ago the State sent Mr. Weir to Scotland to bring out a Clydesdale horse. That must have cost £1,000. That sum would have placed 10 good bulls at the disposal of the South-West. I am not blaming anyone, because I do not know who to blame. Then the Government bought up mares. What are the foals worth to-day? Very little. I would advocate the growing of more Cape barley. I find it one of the best things I can grow. The cows can get a bite off it before the natural grasses are coming. With regard to couch, I have been growing it for nine years and it keeps dairy cows going all the summer months. It is practically always green and you can get rich coloured butter out of it. There are a great many places in the South-West where it will grow. There are hundred of these swamps round about where it will grow. It is a very hardy plant and even the salt water will not kill it.

10611. By Mr. PAYNTER: Did you come here to engage in dairying?—I was dairying in Victoria, but I could not get hold of good land. I was there for 20 years. I was there until I was 40 and then when my family started to grow up I looked round and wrote over to Western Australia. I received some favourable answers and made a flying trip. Mr. Hopkins, who was then Minister for Lands, said "We will do anything we can for Victorian dairymen," but nothing has been done in my case.

10612. What amount of capital does a man require to start dairying?—It all depends on the man. Some will succeed on nothing. It is the man and not his capital. The principal thing is to get feed. The question is what you can start a place for. You must have 20 or 30 acres of cleared land. A man must fight along for a few years and make the best of things.

10613. By Mr. VENN: Are you satisfied with your venture on the Stirling estate?—It was the best days work I ever did when I came to Western Australia. There are plenty of good places about the South-West fit for dairying. With regard to men not in such good country, they might turn the poor land to better account. I have worked a bit of poor country. If I were out on ordinary bush land, I would go in for grape vines for summer feed. Close observation has convinced me that there are thousands of tons of feed in the leaves of vines and the stock could be let loose on them. They will not destroy the vine. Sheep are also fond of the leaves. When the Autumn comes, prune the vines and cultivate the land just the same. I am speaking from experience. The leaves are green in the driest time of the year. Vines will grow in the poor sandy land. They throw off tons of foliage. You will get more from an acre of vines than from anything else you can grow. The vines would be planted in rows 10 feet apart.

(The witness retired.)