mediately. I cannot say that a definite promise was given by the Labour Government although I take it the promise was made. No sane man would take up land there without the expectation of a railway.

406. By Mr. McDONALD: In the mallee land of South Australia there is a lot of farming done far from any railway?— — Yes, I do not know the modern names of places in the South Australian mallee. The dams in the Esperance-Norseman district fill and never empty again. Out east of Fraser's Range there is some beautiful land. In 1896 wheat and oats 4ft. high could be seen growing in all the old camps along the road.

(The witness retired.)

THOMAS RUSSEL ORR, aged 51, Storekeeper, Esperance, married, six sons, two daughters, 8 years to 23 years— sworn and examined:

407. Where are your sons?— Two are at the Front.

408. What land do you hold in this district?— I have 348 acres of C.P., Nos. 377, 378 and 388. I have also 30 acres of garden area and several town blocks. I have been storekeeping here for the last two years. I have been here altogether 21 years. Previous to storekeeping I was engaged in mixed farming at Esperance. For about 16 years I got no other money that what I received for mixed farming. I reared a big family and came off the farm owing no man anything. It was not practicable to specialise in the production of any one thing because there were no means of disposing of it. Therefore I had to grow mainly what my own family required and a little to sell. For instance, vegetables, eggs, milk, butter, honey, mutton, and a little wool for sale. In those early days there was a fair local market, but I was struggling at the time and when I was ready to produce the population had gone. Butter can be profitably produced here. There is no difficulty in carrying the cows over the summer because root crops and Lucerne can be grown with ease and certainty. The dairy cows I had, were of common class. For seven years I always grew from 20 to 30 tons of hay. This was mainly sold. I was not satisfied with the crops because it was mainly sandplain and gave me only about half a crop, but that was because I was ignorant of the best way of treating the sandplain. My neighbour who cultivated for two to three years and grazed between crops, had much better success than did I with my annual cropping. I used as much as a bag of super to the acre, and a bushel of wheat, or alternatively a bushel and a half of oats. There is no salt on my land, although I am only a mile from Pink Lake. There is rather too much rain on the sandplain country, and it required to be treated accordingly. As a storekeeper I have had very little business with mallee farmers. This year I have paid 4s. 6d. per bushel. I am not buying much, for there is nothing to be done with it in our cramped market.

409. By Mr. PADBURY: Is there much land about here with excess water?— Hundreds of thousands of acres. I have tried grasses and they do well on cleared land. I do not know the names of all the grasses I have tried. Excess water does not detrimentally affect the grasses as it does the crops.

410. By the CHAIRMAN: I think you have some bees?— Yes, this is a particularly good place for bees. I have netted £1 per hive per year. Bees can keep themselves all through the winter without any feeding back. I have been a teamster on the road for two years, during which I drank from natural depressions along the road without finding evidence of salt. Any salt there should be in this district is not likely to interfere with agriculture. The railway to the 60-Mile would serve the settlers. Lucerne thrives specifically here. Through freights from Fremantle to Esperance are: By the "Eucla," 35s., by the boats of the Melbourne S.S. Coy., 48s., for general cargo.

(The witness retired.)

EDWIN LEWIS WARD, aged 54, Gardener, Esperance, married, three sons and two daughters, ages 8 to 17, sworn and examined:

411. B the CHAIRMAN: What land do you hold in the district?— There is a garden area of 50 acres in my wife's name. I have been 3½ years in the district. The first year, 1914, I put in six acres of potatoes on Harrison's Patch, which I leased, and which had been worked for a number of years before. I got 150 bags from the lot. Some of the potatoes went over 1lb. weight. I sold odd bags to the storekeepers. The bulk of them I carted up to Norseman, selling some in the mallee. I got 14s. for them, being 2s. above the market price. The balance I sold for seed. Cartage to Norseman at that time was £13 a ton. I had to buy chaff all the way along, but there was plenty of water on the roads. I have grown all kinds of vegetables for good returns. I have a 5-acre garden, planted 15 years ago with fruit trees and vines. I am looking after it for a friend in Kalgoorlie. The peaches are too thick on the trees. Grapes reach 8lbs. and 9lbs. weight per bunch. I came to Esperance from the fields, where I was hotel-keeping on account of the wife and children. I gave up hotel-keeping on the fields in order to come here for the better climate, and of course in expectation of a railway. I took two loads of apricots overland to Ravensthorpe last year, but they did not carry well. The next lot I sent round by boat, but by this route the fruit has to lie at Hopetoun for days. I can grow anything in the shape of fruit and vegetables. All I want is a market.

412. By Mr. PADBURY: Even if you can grow exceptional potatoes it would not pay you without a railway?— No. Down here each one grows his own potatoes.

413.By Mr. McDONALD: Do you remember the mallee country in South Australia?— I have seen a good deal of it. My father had several places in the mallee districts. It has much drier there than on this mallee. Our mallee retains the water better than that of South Australia.

(The witness retired.)

JOHN GOODLIFF, aged 59, Hotelkeeper, Esperance, married, no family— sworn and examined:

414. By the CHAIRMAN: What land do you occupy?— None at present, except Town Lot 22, Andrew-street, which is on. I have been 20 years in the district. I have been keeping the hotel