was asking a farthing profit, but the service he was rendering to the Pool.

2418. You have told us that Professor Lefroy pointed out that the wheat can be kept for five years if treated properly?—Yes.

2419-49. I suppose you are aware that this has been tried at Geraldton?—I have never heard of it. All I know is that the Geraldton stack is full of weevils.

2450. This year?—I have heard from Mr. Pearse that there are certain treatment plants.

2451. You think Professor Lefroy better able to say than any wheat experts in Western Australia?—I do. I think he is a top-notch man. He has been in India, where they have a moister climate to deal with, and he has been in Mesopotamia. We are only pigmies in dealing with weevils. We have tried experiments and they say they are not successful. If Professor Lefroy came here he would probably point out where you are wrong. He has the highest credentials of any man.

2452. In your opinion, as far as experts are concerned in this State,you do not think their advice should be passed over for Professor Lefroy's?—Who? Do you refer to Mr. Keys? Who are the experts?

2453. By Mr. BROWN: Are there any wheat experts?—There are some gentlemen who know something about wheat, but I would not call them experts. There is not an expert in the State as regards weevils, because we have never had weevils to deal with seriously. We have never kept our wheat two years. But I know from inquiries I have made in Melbourne what respect Professor Lefroy is held in. He is looked on as the last word on weevils.

2454. You think it should be carried into effect?—Undoubtedly.

2455. You know Professor Lefroy has a preparation?—Yes, it is a preparation of tar.

2456. It is naphthaline, I think?—Yes.

2457. The Wheat Pool are of opinion that the use of naphthalene will destroy a large quantity of the wheat in the lower part of the stacks?—I would not take any more notice of their opinion than that of my office boy about weevils.

2458. Seeing that this preparation in your opinion, on the recommendation of Professor Lefroy, is likely to get over the difficulty, would it not for the time being get over the expense of of providing for bulk storage?—I do not want it to be thought that I think naphthaline will get over the trouble. If I were in charge of the Scheme and Professor Lefroy was available I would ask him to come here and look at the conditions. I would ask him what was to be done to store the wheat in bags for five years, free from weevils, and I would follow out absolutely what he said, as I would the advice of a medical man. As to the storage of wheat in silos, we will have to have this if we are to be an up-to-date country and a producing country. As to the best silos and the cost, that I have not gone into.

2459. The position is this, there is a possibility of our wheat being stored for three years, and on an average our harvests can be taken at 15,000,000 bushels. That will mean 45,000,000 bushels? — Yes.

2460. An amount of £300,000 or £400,000 will only provide storage for 5,000,000?—I should provide for 5,000,000 bushels and the balance should be stored in the best way to protect it from weevils and other difficulties such as weather.

2461. Do you think it advisable to put the farmer to the expense of making storage under bulk storage system for the wheat that is grown?—You say 5,000,000 bushels. That is one-third of the crop for the year—the highest we have had has been 18,000,000 bushels. The storage can be used in connection with bulk handling and when we get bulk handling we shall be able to grade the wheat. If I grow wheat that goes 64lbs. or 67lbs. to the bushel I only get the same price as the man growing inferior wheat. If I am going to get some benefit from my good farming, it is by grading, and I get a certificate for it and we shall be able to select cargoes of the different classes of wheat, but at the present time the cargoes sent away are good, bad, and indifferent. If we have bulk handling, the wheat will be graded and the different grades can be sold.

2462. You would not advocate the bulk handling system unless the farmer is going to get some pecuniary benefit?—Certainly not. The silos proposed to be put down are part and parcel of a bulk handling system. In a very few years no boats will be coming here except for bulk wheat. It is an economic waste for us to be paying 9s. or 10s. a dozen bags, which means 3d. a bushel, when by a system of bulk handling we can have our wheat graded at 1d. or 1¼d. a bushel. The boats will come to Fremantle, the shoots will be opened, and the wheat goes into the ship. We have to produce wheat in competition with the world, and if we are going to be a wheat-growing community we shall have to grow it under the best conditions and in the biggest quantities.

2463. You refer to the saving in cost of bags which are provided for the wheat. That would only apply at present to those who can get the advantage of the small amount of storage which would be supplied?—It would be spread over the whole lot. If we could put in five million bushels at a cost of 1¼d. or 1½d. and the other ten million went in with bags some arrangement would have to be made, or it would go to the benefit of the Pool. You think it would be one-third of the farmers who would get their bags back. An arrangement could easily be made so that the Scheme would provide the farmers with bags. Instead of me buying the bags they would supply them and debit them to the scheme. Of course I would have to account for the bags.

2464. You would only pay in proportion to the other men? — Yes.

2465. You would not agree that the man who would be able to avail himself of the bulk storage should be allowed to do so at less cost than the man who had to buy bags?—That would not stand for a minute, as it would not be equitable. Assuming that there was a capacity for a third of the harvest in bulk storing, and two-thirds of it stored in bags; the only equitable way would be for the Scheme to say that whatever bags the farmers required they would supply, and that the farmers would requisition for their requirements. If I were supplied with 5,000 bags I would have to return that number, otherwise I would be charged with the difference. Then the Scheme would be in the position that those who got their wheat into bulk without any charge for bags would not benefit individually, but the whole of the farmers would benefit. It would be a matter of indifference to me whether my wheat was in bags or bulk. That is the only equitable way in which the business could be carried out.

2466. You are aware that the intention of the Federal Government is that the interest and other charges would have to be borne by the Pool?—I think the Federal Government have raised a loan of £2,850,000, of which £285,000 have been allocated to Western Australia. There are certain conditions which are set out in the Federal Bill. One of these is this: the bulk handling scheme will be controlled by a committee, consisting of a representative from each of the wheat-growing States and a representative of the Commonwealth Government. If, however, any decision is arrived at by the board which does not fall in with the ideas of the Commonwealth representative, he is to have the power of veto. In addition to this £285,000, which was supposed to allocated to this State, bulk storage is being guaranteed by this state. That being so, I have a decided objection personally—I do not say that my association entertains this objection—to such an arrangement, because it means that you are perpetuating what we object to here, an advisory board with a power of veto of the Commonwealth Government, which would not only extend to the building of a shed but to the operations of the silos in future years, although they are paid for.

2467. Are you aware that once the silos are built they are to be handed over to the Australian Wheat Board which fixes the cost of using them?—If so, it means that the Australian Wheat Board will be paying for a certain portion of the upkeep and probably the depreciation. That may be a business proposition but I have never considered it. It seems to me essential that bulk storing of whatever condition and the running of the Pool should be under one authority.

2468. By Mr. BROWN: If any wheat of the incoming crop is milled for other than local requirements, how would you fix a fair price for milling, a gristing price?—I have already explained that owing to the different systems at the mills the cost of production must be different. Therefore, in connection with this particular Pool, the only way in which to deal with is to