WEDNESDAY, 31Sst JULY, 1918

(At Perth)

Hon. W. C Angwin, M.L.A. (Chairman).

Hon J. F. Allen, M.L.C ./ Hon. R.G. Ardagh, M.L.C.

J. H. Harrison, Esq., M.L.A. / S. M. Brown Esq., M. L. A.

4756. By the CHAIRMAN: This Commission has been appointed for the purpose of inquiring into the handling of wheat, and it has been asked to take into the handling of wheat, and it has been asked to take into consideration the question of bulk storage. I understand that in 1914 you went into the question of bulk handling while you were in Canada. The Commission would be glad to have any information you can supply on the subject so far as it affects cost of construction and cost of handling, and also how it would apply to normal conditions and the present abnormal conditions?—The information you ask for is contained in my report of the 27th June, 1914.

4757. I note that you state in that report with reference to country elevators that the majority of those elevators erected in Canada are built of timber and are of 25,000 bushel capacity?—They vary from 10,000 to 250,000 bushel capacity.

4758. You say that the standard is 25,000 bushels? The 25,000 bushel standard is the most general. It's dimensions, built of timber, are 24feet by 30 feet, and about 45 feet high. They are generally fitted with six storage bins and two service bins. The capacity of the bins varies from 1,000 to 5,000 bushels. As a rule these elevators are operated by a 6 horse-power gasolene engine, but where cleaning machine is also used the engine power is increased to 10 to 12 horse-power. The cost of these elevators complete without cleaning machinery varies from £1,000 to £1,300, and with cleaning machinery from £100 to £200 more. The timber used in the building costs £4 per thousand super feet. It may be taken that the cost of the country elevator in Canada built of timber works out at from 9d. to 10d. per bushel storage capacity without cleaning machinery, and from 10½d. to 1s. with cleaning machinery. The latest practice is to build these elevators in reinforced concrete.

4759. The elevator of 25,000 bushel capacity would be about the size required in this State?—It would vary; that would probably be the minimum capacity.

4760. What do you mean by two service bins?—These are the bins from which the wheat is discharged or spouted into the trucks.

4761. Under the system it is intended to establish here, which is more for storage than for bulk handling, and owing to the fact, according to the evidence that we have had placed before us, that the storage is wanted particularly to assist in combating the weevil, would it be necessary to build extra bins for the purpose of shifting the wheat to clean out the weevil ; in other words if you put up two silos one would have to be remain empty for the purpose of receiving the clean wheat?—That is quite a different proposition to the Canadian elevator system. I really am not sufficiently acquainted with the weevil trouble to express an opinion as to whether you would require extra bins for handling weevily wheat. I should think, however, that to deal with the weevil you would require a spare silo. But I have never dealt with the weevil question.

4762. Has Mr. Pearse ever discussed this with you?—We have discussed silos and silo construction, but I do not remember ever having discussed weevils with him.

4763. According to Mr. Pearse's evidence before the Commission his one idea is, and it appears to be the idea of the Board, that the storage is wanted now more to protect the wheat from weevil. In Canada they have built sufficient storage for the wheat as it goes through the market. They do not store it any considerable length of time?—The elevator is filled and emptied four or five times in a season. I do not remember having heard anything about the weevil question in Canada while I was there.

4764. The bins proposed to be built here at the present time are of a larger capacity than would be required for handling wheat under normal capacity than would be required for handling wheat under normal conditions, and would be constructed at a considerably increased cost?—Yes.

4765. You have never heard of the wheat being taken out of the bin and being put back into it straight away?—No.

4766. You think it is possible to clean the bin of weevil?—If you tip the wheat out you could clean the bin, more especially if it is built in reinforced concrete.

4767. It would be necessary to have some place in which to put the wheat while cleaning the bin?—Yes.

4768. Do you think small country elevators could be built more cheaply in timber than in concrete?—At present prices, yes.

4769. Mr. Pearse told us that they are building them for 10d. a bushel?—That is not the complete elevator but merely a silo without any working house to it. The Canadian country elevators include all the necessary machinery.

4770. But when you went into the agreement with Carter, it was intended to instal this eventually?—Yes. It was intended that the storage bins should form part of any ultimate scheme of bulk handling, and that the temporary machinery used in connection with the silos should be eventually utilised in the broader scheme.

4771. After the storage bins have been erected, a good deal of additional cost will be required to provide for bulk handling?—Yes.

4772. If, as we are told, it will be necessary to occasionally shift the wheat out of the silo, in order to clean the silo, additional bins will have to be provided to shift the wheat into?—Yes. I understand the weevil is not so prevalent in reinforced concrete silos as in timber structures.

4773. Why is that?—I have heard that they cannot get fresh air at a a greater depth than 10 or 11 feet in the concrete silo.

4774. Mr. Pearse told us that , while Mr. Keys says that they work through?—I cannot say from my own knowledge.

4775. By Hon J. F. ALLEN: Grains of wheat, like all other granular material, provide air space from end to end of the mass, unless, indeed, the grains are crushed?—Yes, there is theory that it develops carbon dioxide, which takes the place of the air and poisons the weevils.I could not say how far down a silo the weevil will get.

4776. By the CHAIRMAN: That phase of the question has never been looked into by the officers of the department?—Not by my officers.