agent there as f.a.q. I subsequently saw the same wheat, coming into the Northam sheds, and being received by that firm's representative, and I noted our brand "F" on the parcel. That wheat is still in the shed at Northam.

6574. By the CHAIRMAN : Formerly the agent was responsible for the quality which he received ?—Yes. I should like to show the Commission an apparatus which is the first of its kind in the world so far as I know, and which at one weighing will indicate the percentage of impurity in any sample of wheat. (Demonstration given.) On re-weighing this particular sample indicates two per cent. of impurities removed. In the design of this machine I collaborated with Mr. Wakefield, late of the Agricultural Department. This particular machine is more or less in the rough, and was made by a boy of 16.

6575. Have your men been using it in sampling ?—We have used it frequently during this season. The scales have been submitted both to the Minister and Mr. Sutton who seem to think it of practical use.

6576. By Mr. BROWN : Has it been patented ?—No. The rule of thumb system which has hitherto obtained is unsatisfactory. I have put up a sample of wheat to Mr. Gillespie, which he wanted to dock 1s 6d. I thought 1s. was sufficient. We agreed to submit it to Mr. Keys, with the result that Mr. Keys put 9d. on the same sample. I have known this sort of thing to happen on different occasions. On two successive days I have had the same sample valued by Mr. Keys, on one day at 6d. and on the other day at a difference of 3d. I did not put the samples up with any ulterior motive, but merely desired to satisfy myself as to whether or not the rule of thumb method was only guess-work. I satisfied myself that it was, and that it depends upon the state of the sampler's liver or whether he had a good breakfast. Threepence per bushel does not seen much, but means a lot to the farmer concerned. We think that a scientific method such as this would be more satisfactory.

6577. By Mr. HARRISON : That would be all right so far as impurities or the admixture of other grains were concerned, but a scale of that kind would not identify any smutty wheat ?—No.

6578. Do you depend upon your nose in the case of smut ?—To a considerable extent.

6579. The nose is more to be relied upon than the sight ?—I think so.

6580. By the CHAIRMAN : I have here a sample of wheat taken from Midland Junction and classed as rejected ?—We have had a great deal worse than this sold in Perth at a good price. If we submitted a sample of this nature to Dalgety's they would ask us to send the wheat forward for auction.

6581. By Mr. BROWN : The poor poultry farmer does not get value ?—No. The price of inferior wheat is out of all proportion to the nature of the product. It has been suggested by representatives of the old firms that we have had no experience. This machine is an instance of our desire to do things in a scientific way. The suggestions in this connection seem to me to be somewhat similar to those regarding every movement for betterment. In connection with sampling, I suggest that we should have a somewhat similar arrangement in this State as obtains in Canada. There might with advantage be appointed a grain disputes committee, upon which there would be one representative chosen by the Minister ad another chosen by the farmers. These two members before the beginning of a season would agree upon an umpire to be referred to in cases of dispute. If any farmer felt himself aggrieved he could send a sample to that committee for an unbiased adjudication.

6582. By Mr. HARRISON : Do you think the volume of dockage in the past would warrant the expenditure upon such a committee ?— Have you any idea of the cost of the dockages and what has been docked from the farmers this year and last year ?—The amount is correctly stated in Mr. Key's evidence. There was then a matter of £100 or £200 between us.

6583. Do you remember that in reply to certain questions it has been stated that the total dockage had not paid for the cost ?—I cannot explain that. I am confident that if the whole crop could be shipped within the next few months it could be shipped showing the Scheme a profit on the dockages.

6584. Do you think that inferior quality wheat should be assessed irrespective of cost ?— It would be good for the Pool and for the farmers that an expense of this kind should be incurred, and would be for the future good of the growers in this State in connection with the shipment of wheat abroad ?—I do not think a Disputes Committee need cost anything. I think there must be some incentive to the farmer to grow a good quality wheat, and that therefore there must be dockage of some kind. The system which has obtained in this State is altogether inequitable, haphazard, and purely guess-work.

6585. I suppose it would always remain guess-work in regard to smut ?—The percentage of smutty wheat in relation to the whole crop is infinitesimal. Smut can be almost wholly eliminated.

6586. By the CHAIRMAN : Do you think that if the running bulk sample was adopted for the farmer it would encourage him not to clean his wheat properly ?—I think if there were adopted the suggestion which has been submitted as part and parcel of the running bulk sample it would be an incentive to the farmer to grow good wheat. The farmer who got a small premium on his prime wheat would endeavour to grow prime wheat.

6587. Under the present system is it not impossible to pay an increased price for prime wheat ?—Off-hand, I think not. But I would like to know the figure of dockage. I cannot recollect it for the moment. Assuming it was a £12,000 dock this year, I contend it would pay the Scheme to ear-mark, say, £8,000 of that £12,000 for premium. The Scheme could afford to do that without any loss whatever, because if they could ship the wheat now, they would effect that much saving.

6588. But when the standard is fixed, that is done by taking certain samples from the various districts in the State: and that wheat is mixed all together and weighed, so as to fix the weight of the fair average quality ?—That is so. There is supposed to be a representative sample, including prime, average, and inferior wheat all bulked together. I do not see why a premium should not be allowed as part and parcel of a bulk sampling scheme.

6589. By Mr. HARRISON : Is there any likelihood of our selling our wheat at a better value than at present under the Pool system, if we had higher grade wheat than that of the other States ?—We have not the opportunity of handling the shipping part of the trade, and for that reason we are to some extent out of touch with it ; but wheat is bought on the basis of the f.a.q. sample, it should fetch more than the f.a.q. price.

6590. Has Western Australia obtained any advantage during the last two years ? —I cannot say, because we are eliminated from the shipping.

6591. Have you any idea how Western Australian wheat has compared with Eastern States wheat for the last two years ? —I believe ours is very much superior.

6592. Yet you do not know of our having received any advantage in price ?— I think we ought to receive an advantage. The next matter that concerns the farmer is the weighing. In this and one or two other connections which I would to mention, we have regard to the fact that a saving to us is a saving to the farmer. Having this in mind, we submitted to the Scheme at the beginning of the season that at such sidings as had weighbridges these weighbridges should be used. Notwithstanding our making repeated representations in this regard, the Scheme turned our proposition down. For doing so they gave two reasons; in the first place that they required, they said, to keep weights of the wheat going into the different bays at the depots, and in the second place that the Railway Department required marked weights for the charging up of freight. Well, we found that the exact weights of the wheat going into the various bays at the depots have not been kept. In fact, when last I heard from Spencer's Brook depot, there was one full bay of wheat and the Government records showed that there was no wheat in it. I believe the Railway Department a assessing freights on the number of bushels contained in each bag, without having regard at all to the weights marked on individual bags. Take for example Grass Valley, where there is a weighbridge. This year, we are told, is the first year in the history of Grass Valley that wheat has been weighed over single bag scales. Hitherto the weighbridge has been used there. I would like to compare our having been forced to adopt, even at centres where weighbridges exist, the prehistoric single bag scales, with the more progressive methods adopted in the United States; and therefore I will read an extract from " The Book of Wheat"—

 A few years ago the average weight of the loads weighed at Minneapolis was 20 tons. Now monstrous weighing machines weigh 50 tons at a time. Some States have a State weighing Department. That of Minnesota, located at Minneapolis, has given service which steadily grows in public confidence and favour. In 1902, it employed 68 persons and supervised weighing at 42 elevators and 17 flour mills, besides four feed mills, five oil mills, and three railroad yards. It weighed 233,127 car loads and 5,564